NLDS Game Five, 2015

Mets at Dodgers, 5:00PM PT, TV: TBS

“This one’s for all the marbles.” “Win or go home.” “There’s no tomorrow for one of these teams.”

Those are clichés for a reason: they’re all true. Banal, trite, and eye-roll inducing, but true.

The Dodgers ask Zack Greinke to do what he’s done all year: hold the other team to fewer than three runs as he did in all but two starts and score more than that themselves. The Dodgers will have to get those runs off Jacob deGrom, who’s got a 3.66 ERA in three regular season starts against them, which shows he can be reached. In Game One, though, he was nearly unhittable, striking out 13 in seven shutout innings.

Turner is probable to start while Grandal is 50-50.

Lineup when available.

Defense, defense! That’s the goal of this lineup, as Mr. Weisman sees it.

  • Audit

    No complaints on the lineup.

    • Bumsrap

      A good mix of young and not so young.

  • WBBsAs

    I’m a bit surprised Grandal is starting, as he seems to be really hurting.

    • Bumsrap

      I guess Greinke prefers Grandal and Mattingly doesn’t think Grandal will hit any worse than Ellis against de Grom. Greinke doesn’t need Elllis’ play calling as much as other pitchers do.

  • John_from_Aus

    I like the lineup

  • Audit

    What’s going on in the comment’s section at places like TruBlu LA or Dodger Digest? I can’t stand to go there.

    • package206

      Mike P on DD questions Grandal over Ellis.

      • Audit

        I read that. I was wondering if the commenters were as inactive as they are here.

        • WBBsAs

          There’s lots of good analysis at DoDi, but the writing often suffers, and you get a lot of juvenilia from the commenters – not to mention cat gifs.

          • Audit

            That’s the part I can’t stand.

          • WBBsAs

            Which part?

        • package206

          Too much foolishness from the commenters for me.

  • Audit

    Bumsrap, what was that Dodger blog you mentioned a while back? This one is mighty weak.

  • ITFDB, and I’m nervous. Who’s with me?

    • package206

      Wish I was more confident.

      • John_from_Aus

        I’m nervous too.
        Since I will only be able to check the scores and this blog now and then, I’m not sure if that makes me more or less nervous

        • Bob_Hendley

          Say hi to the kids from us.

          • John_from_Aus

            🙂 Will do, they are back in about 6 minutes from their recess break

  • WinnipegDave

    Show time.

  • WinnipegDave

    This is the Game 5 scenario that we had hoped for and imagined would happen last year – Greinke pitching at Dodger Stadium.

  • WinnipegDave

    Out? Safe?

    • WBBsAs

      Close but clearly safe.

  • WinnipegDave

    Shoot.

    • WinnipegDave

      Another lucky hit for the Mets.

  • WinnipegDave

    Boo. I don’t like Granderson and Murphy.

  • package206

    Pederson miss played that ball.

    • WinnipegDave

      As did Kiké

    • WBBsAs

      No, he didn’t. It was not catchable. Arguably, Quique misplayed the carom.

      • WinnipegDave

        Not catchable but it did bounce back over Joc’s head off the wall.

        • package206

          Hence, missplayed.

        • WBBsAs

          Unpredictable carom, Quique slipped when he went for it.

  • John_from_Aus

    not the best start, hopefully we can limit the damage

  • WinnipegDave

    Big K there.

  • John_from_Aus

    Phew, that could have been so much worse

    • WinnipegDave

      Indeed. Glad to have you still checking John!

  • WinnipegDave

    My pick to click tonight is Andre Ethier.

  • WinnipegDave

    Seager hitting the other way is beautiful.

  • WinnipegDave

    Everybody hits!

  • WinnipegDave

    Let’s go Red Thunder!

  • Bob_Hendley

    AGon with the wheels.

    • John_from_Aus

      in second gear

  • WinnipegDave

    Hey RBI – are you at the game?

    • Bob_Hendley

      As I recall she had tix.

      • WinnipegDave

        Maybe she is yet to arrive.

        • Bob_Hendley

          She may be otherwise engaged and a bundle of nerves.

  • WinnipegDave

    Ok Andre. Make me look good.

    • Bob_Hendley

      You look kinda dinky. (but we will take it!)

      • WinnipegDave

        So true! You know me so well…

        • Bob_Hendley

          Your son is awful handsome, for sure.

          • WinnipegDave

            My son just asked me to say to everyone here tonight! He is watching the game with me. Sorta – he is also on his iPad.

    • WinnipegDave

      Oh yeah!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Would love to get a bundle here.

    • WinnipegDave

      Ah well. Nice to get the lead back so quickly anyway.

  • Grandal is gonna need to get that shoulder fixed after the season.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Hopefully he has to wait until November.

    • WBBsAs

      Rest or perhaps a cleanup.

  • WBBsAs

    I usually wait until 6 p.m. for a glass of wine, but I’ve decided to start early.

    • WinnipegDave

      What you got in the glass tonight?

      • WBBsAs

        Still finishing a bottle of NZ Nobilo Sauvignon Blanc.

    • I quit drinking in 2000, but …

      • WBBsAs

        I have a nightly glass, rarely more than that.

        • I’ve been known to have a bloody Mary once in a while, but the 2+ six-packs per night are a distant and not-so-good memory.

          • WinnipegDave

            Good for you Link!

          • Well, they got spread out over a bunch of hours. I was pretty functional.

          • WinnipegDave

            Just so you know – I meant good for you for stopping.

          • I knew what you meant. Thanks.

          • WinnipegDave

            Great.

  • package206

    Dre!! That’s playing the ball!! Good Job!!

  • Hurray, Andre!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Drefense!

    • WinnipegDave

      Ohhh – I like that!

      • Bob_Hendley

        He inspired me.

  • WinnipegDave

    Andre! With the glove work. Not so dinky now!

  • 5Ks in 6 outs? Is this Zack or Clayton?

    • WinnipegDave

      Oh yeah!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Now let’s get back to that offense stuff.

  • package206

    Does anyone have anything new on Vinny??

    • WBBsAs

      He’s out for the rest of the season. Get used to being Steinered (or Darlinged if you’re watching TBS).

      • Bob_in_Vegas

        More important, I’d like to know how he’s doing.

      • package206

        I have TBS.

  • John_from_Aus

    walk or HR

    • Bob_Hendley

      or….

    • WinnipegDave

      He does have a good eye.

  • Bob_in_Vegas

    Was walking my dog when I heard NY score.
    Stayed for the bottom of the 1st and they scored again. It wasn’t three runs this time, but three consecutive games out walking and LA scores.
    We WOULD stay out there the entire game, but it might rain and I’m trying to hear author Brad Meltzer give a talk (while also listening to the game).

    • WinnipegDave

      You’ve done your part!

      • Bob_in_Vegas

        I’ll give the credit to Frodo, my dog.

  • WBBsAs

    OBPederson

    • WinnipegDave

      Oh wow. I like that too!

  • WinnipegDave

    Safe!

  • Bob_in_Vegas

    The Dodger bats apparently didn’t make adjustments in Friday’s game . . . but apparently have since then.
    Score more . . . and even more!

  • WinnipegDave

    Love seeing shots of the Mets bullpen!

    • Bob_Hendley

      Rather they keep this guy in.

      • WinnipegDave

        Are you sure?

        • Bob_Hendley

          Well, not if he pitches like that!

      • package206

        Think I would rather he go early.

        • WBBsAs

          Thor is just as tough, throws harder.

  • Argh! If he gets that changeup working we’d better figure it out quick.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Kid comes up with some big K’s in these two innings.

    • WBBsAs

      They’re right on the fastball, had a chance to break it open that inning.

  • WinnipegDave

    Need to get de Grom.

    • Bob_Hendley

      and de Granderson…

      • WinnipegDave

        And Wright…

        • Bob_Hendley

          and de left (Murphy).

          • WinnipegDave

            Ha.

  • Bob_Hendley

    I like that we have mostly befuddled Wright. Dangerous fellow.

  • WinnipegDave

    Greinke looks like he knows what he wants to do our there and so far is getting it done.

    • Bob_Hendley

      seems really on

    • Bob_Hendley

      On a 100 pitch six innings so far.

  • JT of the Red Beard is ferocious! 9-17 in the NLDS!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Ha! In pre-game Pedro underestimating JT because of the bad wheels. Said that Howie should bat fourth to protect AGon.

  • WinnipegDave

    It’s like Lawrence Welk – someone forgot to turn off the doubles machine!

    • WBBsAs

      The Dodgers had it last year.

      • WinnipegDave

        I know!

      • Bob_Hendley

        Though it was a dinger machine (would have run out of soap this year)

    • Audit

      Stan Freberg

  • Bob_Hendley

    Mr. Bad Wheels!

    • WinnipegDave

      In there!

  • WinnipegDave

    Good AB by Grandal – just taking the walk.

  • WinnipegDave

    What’s up Andre?

  • Bob_Hendley

    Not good.

  • Drat!

  • package206

    Wonder where Dre will be playing next year?

    • WBBsAs

      Platooning in RF and LF.

      • package206

        I meant his new team.

        • Bob_Hendley

          Wherever he plays.

        • WBBsAs

          He’s not going anywhere, unless some other team wants to massively overpay for a platoon guy.

          • package206

            If Donnie doesn’t like you, he will have you traded and pay all of your salary.

          • foul tip

            Managers have some input, but they don’t make personnel decisions. Pretty basic thing.

          • package206

            I was speaking of the input. Same situation as Matty.

          • WBBsAs

            Kemp had some value. Dre, much lower upside, wouldn’t bring much in return.

          • Bob_Hendley

            Supposedly Dre- Montero trade was in the works last year, before the owner got involved.

          • WBBsAs

            Would have made sense for Dodgers at that time, not much for Snakes with good young OFers.

    • Audit

      Ethier has a better chance of being here next year than DM.

      • package206

        You are correct and this game might determine that thought.

  • WinnipegDave

    Kiké magic is disappearing.

  • Dodgers, we need more than two runs. Turn the offense back on, please.

    • WinnipegDave

      Just need to hit with RISP.

  • WinnipegDave

    Glad to have Joc out there!

    • Bob_Hendley

      Needs to do one of those two good things leading off at the bottom.

  • Live and die with the shift.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Seager not enough reps in the shift. (can’t imagine they use it on the farm)

  • WinnipegDave

    Drat.

  • Drat again.

  • Bob_Hendley

    After all this…tied!

  • Bob_in_Vegas

    Missed opportunity+ stolen opportunity= tie.
    Let’s go bats!

  • WinnipegDave

    Feels like the defense/fielding has given up both runs.

    • WBBsAs

      The first run was always going to score. The second shouldn’t have.

  • WinnipegDave

    We want Utley the crowd chants.

  • WinnipegDave

    We need a hit and a run!

  • WinnipegDave

    Come on young padiwan.

    • Bob_Hendley

      I don’t know what that means.

      • WinnipegDave

        Star Wars. Jedi thing.

        • package206

          Do they play baseball on Star Wars?

        • Bob_Hendley

          Never paid attention to any of that stuff (I feel like WBB), but that didn’t stop me from wearing a Princess Lelia (?) wig at Nats Dodger Star Wars game.

          • package206

            Ha! Ha!

  • Oh, man. We have got to hit with RISP or we’re gonna lose this game. 2-11 with 6 LOB.

    • WinnipegDave

      Technically a solo HR or two would also work.

      • There’s only one 4+1 game in our lifetimes, I’m thinking.

        • WinnipegDave

          I do not want to be down 9-5 going into the bottom of the ninth.

      • Bob_Hendley

        Or dinger with guy on first….

  • WinnipegDave

    How many pitches does Greinke have in him tonight?

    • Bob_Hendley

      Regular rest so 110-115? At least.

      • WinnipegDave

        Hopefully that takes him through about 8 innings.

        • Bob_Hendley

          Not so much worried about him. Gotta score some runs!

        • foul tip

          And hopefully with a lead. Law of RISP averages, etc.

          / crosses 8 fingers and a couple toes.

          • Bob_Hendley

            but may start having problems in getting guys on. (and on cue JT with the double)

  • WinnipegDave

    This inning. Runs.

  • WinnipegDave

    Double!

  • JT!

  • WBBsAs

    Conforto does The Full Cuddyer!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Let’s go Dre! (save your job and Donnie’s!)

  • 0-for last 10 with RISP.

  • I’d PH for Grandal.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Who?

      • AJ

        • Bob_Hendley

          You are desperate!

          • Well, it didn’t have to be him, but you’d have to put him in anyway, so why not?

          • package206

            He would do a better job hitting than Grandal.

          • foul tip

            Than the current edition of Grandal, anyway. But AJ is a playoff beast.

  • 0-11.

  • WinnipegDave

    Frustrated!!

    • package206

      Get some ice cream!

      • WinnipegDave

        We don’t have any!

        • package206

          Uh Oh!

        • package206

          How do you like Foul Tip now!

          • WinnipegDave

            He needs to learn to share!

          • foul tip

            Be glad to, but it would have been kinda messy by the time it got there.

      • foul tip

        Just finished off the last of a gallon of vanilla/orange swirl. Doing my part.

  • foul tip

    Not that Greinke could be happy with all the RISP failures, but odds are very high it will affect him far less than most pitchers.

    • Greinke may step up and hit a HR, then come back into the dugout and say “That’s how it’s done, boys.”

      • Bob_in_Vegas

        Ha!
        But it WAS Kersh who was responsible for the rally Tuesday.

  • Bob_in_Vegas

    What started so promisingly offensively has returned to the same old frustration. But at least they’re getting on vs him this time.

    • Yeah, but they can pull him with a lead now.

  • WinnipegDave

    RBI we need you! How can we score without you?

    • package206

      She might have kicked us to the curb?

      • foul tip

        She might be hiding near a concession stand…or elsewhere.

        Especially in Dodger RISP situations. Tonight that’d be 11 Dodger Dogs, or somesuch.

    • RBI

      I’m here! But there’s very little service!

      • package206

        Bet Momma’s not happy?

        • RBI

          Not right now. Why didn’t Mattingly try a squeeze when DeGrom was freaked out?

          • package206

            Outstanding question but Donnie doesn’t do much squeezing.

          • RBI

            As in, never?

          • package206

            You got it. We should be winning this game easy, RBI!

  • Oh, man.

  • package206

    Ouch!!

  • WBBsAs

    A career mediocrity having the hot streak of his life.

    • package206

      Guess its time for another glass of wine WBB, huh?

  • package206

    Atta Boy Zack!!, One more out.

  • WinnipegDave

    Doubles suck compared to HR’s.

  • foul tip

    In no way giving up, but if the Dodgers don’t come back, the unpleasant truth is that teams that go 0/11 with RISP really don’t deserve to win.

    • And teams that let the other guys steal third with no one covering, thereby taking away the momentum when he scored on a sac fly to tie.

  • Greinke’s up third. Pinch-hit for him?

    • WBBsAs

      Probably, if runners on base.

    • package206

      Who ya got in mind?

      • Someone who can get on base, or possibly drive in a run if there’s anyone there already.

        • package206

          With RISP?

  • WinnipegDave

    Oh da Duda day – another strikeout for Greinke.

  • RBI

    Too hard to post!!!! To hard to score!!!!!

  • WinnipegDave

    F!

    • Three more innings. We can do this.

    • WinnipegDave

      For frustrated…

  • RBI

    Heart stopper!!!

  • RBI

    Also… Why why why did Greinke throw that pitch to Murphy?

    • package206

      Looked like he got it up and in and Murphy turned on it to me.

      • RBI

        Those are the pitches Murphy loves.

    • WinnipegDave

      If the Dodgers had walked him all 3 times we might have been better off

      • RBI

        No question.

  • foul tip

    Think someone said Greinke is 30-5 at home as a Dodger. No good reason for it not to be 31-5.

  • 57 of deGrom’s 105 pitches were with RISP, and he only gave up two runs.

    • RBI

      That’s on us. He was struggling.

    • package206

      That is incredible!

  • RBI

    Falling apart in the seventh here. Once again. Cursed.

    • WinnipegDave

      Greinke smiling in the dugout.

      • RBI

        ???

  • WinnipegDave

    This defence is not sharp tonight.

  • package206

    Does everyone think this is the correct move?

    • WinnipegDave

      Not at all.

      • package206

        Me either.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Yeah, over 100 pitches and lefty coming up.

      • package206

        Atta boy Bob, I knew you had it in you.

        • Bob_Hendley

          Thank goodness Avilan had it!

  • RBI

    I know nothing. I thought we had this one, I really did.

    • Still might.

    • JonnyTAFKAJ

      Hang in there….. RBI

  • JonnyTAFKAJ

    Hey Guys…. Just got home…. “Nail-biter” going on at Chavez Ravine…. 🙂
    Have faith !!!!!!!!!

  • In Game Two after we took Zack out we scored the winning runs in the following inning, making him a winner. Let’s do it again, Dodgers.

  • RBI

    Thor. Ugh.

  • WinnipegDave

    Have to get 2 runs against their pen.

  • 3 Ks for Seager. Welcome to the playoffs, kid.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Alrighty JT!

  • John_from_Aus

    i have a 5 minute window here, lets do something!

    • WinnipegDave

      Sorry John. Not this 5 minutes.

      • John_from_Aus

        I’ll be back later

        • WinnipegDave

          But will the Dodgers?

  • Ack! Now 8 LOB!

    • RBI

      All year, Link. All year. And we’ve pretty much stopped hitting the long balls.

      • WinnipegDave

        Only hit them when we lose.

  • RBI

    Not feeling too good right about now. I don’t mind them beating us, but we are doing this to ourselves.

    • If we lose this thing the Dodgers will lead the league in most disappointed fans. Not just in quantity but in degree as well.

      • RBI

        We HAD them!!!!

  • Bob_Hendley

    Package, we need some of your magic. How are those huckleberries looking?

    • package206

      All right, all right, all right, playtime is over!! Let’s get it on!!

  • WinnipegDave

    Need one final spark on offense. Who will light the match?

    • package206

      You got it Dave!!

  • package206

    I am not ready for the season to be over!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • package206

    Just need 1!

  • package206

    Here come a spark!

  • A one-pitch out, a four-pitch out, and about a six-pitch out. That’s lovely.

  • package206

    Ya’ all got lockjaw?

  • Bob_Hendley

    Chutley may appear in the 9th to PH.

  • WinnipegDave

    Dodgers would be the only home team to lose the deciding game of the division series this year.

  • WBBsAs

    This is the second straight year I’ve taken a seven-day Unlocator trial to watch MLBTV post-season. Last year I cancelled it before paying. I don’t want to do so again.

  • WBBsAs

    Wow. Don uses Kenley in a non-save situation.

    • package206

      There’s no tomorrow!

      • WBBsAs

        Still, that’s not our DM.

  • WinnipegDave

    Hopefully Jansen pitches two innings or gets the win.

  • RBI

    We need some MAGIC!

    • package206

      We got you!!

    • WinnipegDave

      Johnson.

      • RBI

        Ha! Good one!

  • package206

    Cmon now, can’t afford another run for sure.

  • WinnipegDave

    Never feels likes team will come back.
    Until they DO!

    • RBI

      I know. I feel pretty discouraged.

  • RBI

    Smart move.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Oh, didn’t realize that AJ was put in pitcher’s spot.

    • WinnipegDave

      So he has to hit. Will Joc get to bat?

      • Bob_Hendley

        Why not? Has chance to get on base (or even a dinger).

        • Bob_Hendley

          Well, what do I know.

  • RBI

    Rally caps, ON!!!!

  • WinnipegDave

    Here we go!

  • package206

    Let’ go AJ!!

  • WinnipegDave

    Shoot!

  • WinnipegDave

    Hold fast friends! Hang in there.

  • Bumsrap

    I just got caught up with live action. Been watching recorded game since 9:00. I would have left Joc in to get a walk or HR.

    • WinnipegDave

      Yep.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Utley 3-3 off of the guy and got good wood on it though

  • WBBsAs

    Ugly AB by A.J.

    • package206

      There is plenty of blame to go around.

      • WBBsAs

        I agree on that, but it was a truly ugly AB.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Drat!

  • Disappointed.

  • Bumsrap

    I now have more time now that I don’t have to watch as much baseball.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Now looking at the pile of books on my desk.

      • Bob_Hendley

        First one up “Dead Wake” about the Lusitania by Erik Larson (also got on of RBI’s books).

        • Bob_in_Vegas

          LOVE Larson’s work.
          I enjoyed Brad Meltzer’s talk tonight . . . MUCH more entertaining than the frustrating news coming through my ear bud.

          • Bob_Hendley

            My first, but the blurbs on his other books may them appear interesting (as they are wont to do).

          • Bob_in_Vegas

            I recall a blurb which said the non-fiction reads like a thriller . . . and I totally agreed.

  • I can hear it now: “biggest payroll in baseball, out in the first round. Two of the best pitchers in baseball, out in the first round.”

  • Bob_Hendley

    Well, enjoyed sharing the season with you gals and guys.

    • Bumsrap

      I joined in late this year but I enjoyed everybody here as well.

    • JonnyTAFKAJ

      Likewise……..:-)

      How about we comment all throughout the playoffs……..
      And, we violate every rule on the board. HA.

  • WinnipegDave

    We lose 🙁

  • JonnyTAFKAJ

    Well, I hope we all keep in touch here over the rest of the playoffs….
    …..
    Bummer.
    Lots of thoughts……..None really matter……. The end of any Dodger season is reason to be sad.
    …..
    Looking forward to next season.
    Talk soon……….:-)

    • package206

      See Ya, Jonny.

      • JonnyTAFKAJ

        Late! Package. – Have a great night.

  • John_from_Aus

    and that is that

  • Bob_Hendley

    Murphy deserves his own ticker tape parade.

  • There will be blog posts for the rest of the postseason, although my heart won’t be in it.

    • Bob_in_Vegas

      Thanks for giving us this opportunity, Link!

    • WBBsAs

      You may not have heard the last from me this year, but I won’t be paying much attention.

  • Bob_Hendley

    Let’s go Cubs?

    • Bob_in_Vegas

      Absolutely, for me.

    • WBBsAs

      I couldn’t care less, except that I don’t think second-place teams belong in the playoffs, let alone third-place teams.

      • package206

        Wow, 27 years.

        • WBBsAs

          Wow, non sequitur.

          • RBI

            I understood.

          • package206

            Just disappointed.

          • Audit

            Wow, irrelevant.

          • WBBsAs

            Almost everything he says is.

  • WinnipegDave

    Fire Mattingly. Get rid of the FO. Trade all the players.
    Just kidding. 🙂

    • Bob_in_Vegas

      Gotta teach them how to hit with RISP . . . or get a sports hypnotist.

    • Audit

      They may fire Mattingly. And there will be trades but I wouldn’t even try to guess who gets traded or for whom…

      • WinnipegDave

        Maybe we should get Murphy.
        And Alex Gordon.
        And Price.

        • Bob_Hendley

          Recall a couple years ago we tried to get him as a 3rd baseman during mid-season.

        • Howard Fox

          Gordon yes, Price maybe, but not Murphy. He had a few good days. He saved the Mets, but if he wants too much money they will let him go.
          Trade Puig, get Cespedas. An outfield of Cespedas, Pederson, Gordon. An infield of Gonzo, Peraza(?), Seager, Turner. I could live with this lineup.

  • RBI

    Thanks for being here, everyone. And Link, you rock!

  • RBI

    Boo-HOO.

  • Thanks for the company, folks. I’ll try to keep it up through the offseason beyond the World Series.

    • RBI

      Great.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Hot Stove should be interesting.

    • JonnyTAFKAJ

      Thanks so much, Linkmeister.

      I didn’t always comment, but, I consistently checked out Elysian Fields….
      You do an outstanding job here……

      • Nice of you to say so, Jonny. Don’t be such a stranger.

  • WBBsAs

    End of the season is always disappointing but, in a few weeks, I’ll be enjoying springtime in the Southern Hemisphere.

    • John_from_Aus

      I have 30 degrees celcius here today, it is lovely

      • WBBsAs

        86 in real degrees.

  • JonnyTAFKAJ

    I’m just hoping that Vinny is back next year….
    Perhaps I’ve missed it, but have there been any updates on his health?…

  • Bob_in_Vegas

    After hearing stats about the lack of production with RISP — tonight, this series, and the second half of the season, I really can’t see the onus being on Donnie.

    • Before tonight they were hitting .303 with RISP (10 for 33). After tonight it dropped to .260 (12 for 46).

      That’s reasonably respectable, I guess. It just seemed like they couldn’t get runs across when they got guys on base.

  • WinnipegDave

    I want to add my thanks and three cheers for Link for hosting us all so well.
    Losing is so tiring and disheartening. so it will be good to have a break from baseball for a bit. But the World Series is the World Series and at least the Giants can’t win it. Go Royals or maybe Cubs. Please not the Blue Jays with their insufferable – and beer bottle throwing – fans.

    • Bob_Hendley

      I thought that Canadians were supposed to throw hats.

      • WinnipegDave

        Indeed.

      • Howard Fox

        or octopus onto the ice?

    • WBBsAs

      You think Metfans are any better?

      • WinnipegDave

        Pretty sure fans of NY teams don’t assume people from Winnipeg will automatically cheer for them.

        • WBBsAs

          They’re just as capable of throwing bottles, batteries and other objects onto the field. And there are no Mounties to keep them in line.

  • WBBsAs
  • WBBsAs
    • John_from_Aus

      That is one piece of good news 🙂

  • Howard Fox

    I have never been a DM fan. His moves late in the game…Utley for Joc, putting AJ in the 9 spot so he could not bat for him in the 9th, and leaving Puig on the bench…just typical head scratching moves he has always made. Personally, I would have put in AJ instead of Yas who was injured but that is neither here nor there.

    That being said, this game was on the players. DM never should have been confronted with the opportunity to make those and other late game choices. The lack of a big hit, a clutch hit, each of the first 5 innings, that is why they lost. They wasted numerous opportunities. That is why they lost this one.

    If not for Turner, where would be have been. And while he did great, does great, he never inspires fear in opposing pitchers. We need a couple guys in the lineup that other teams need to pitch around. It changes the whole dynamic.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Howie is probably the last Dodger I would ever question regarding his approach at the plate.

      • Howard Fox

        but still, he looked like he had a bus to catch on all 3 swings

        • Bob_Hendley

          It’s a good question on whether they try to resign him, but I would guess that he may want a good number of years and the FO may feel that Quique is their 2nd baseman of the future. His performance over the past couple of years at least suggests that he is not a flash-in-the-pan like Cruz was.

    • Bob_Hendley

      You question not starting AJ and then you question having him bat in the 9th?

      • Howard Fox

        different issues entirely….Yas is not healthy and cannot swing the bat, and AJ, much as I like him, is not the guy you want up bottom of the 9th needing a home run

        • Bob_Hendley

          What you need is a run (or two).

          • Howard Fox

            true…but if I need one swing to tie it, I’d rather it be Joc, then Puig taking those swings….they may strike out…probably would…but you stand a better chance at a game tying home run with them

  • Howard Fox

    One final thought. I have DirecTV. I do not get the regular season games. I have found that there is a life outside of planning each day around what time the Dodger game is on TV. I have a family…who knew?? But having been following the bums since 1959, I am and always will be a fan. There is possibly a generation of possible Dodger fans that may be lost to them because of what is going on with TV.
    That being said, I am pissed off at the Dodgers for temporarily becoming part of my routine again, then making it all for naught. Now, where did my family wander off to again………

    • Audit

      Me too. I feel cheated.

  • Audit

    Heyman thinks the FO may allow DM to interview for the manager jobs in DC and Miami if he wants to, rather than fire him. http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/writer/jon-heyman/25341627/inside-baseball-mattingly-deserves-to-stay-in-la-but-will-he-plus-notes

    • Bumsrap

      I like that. I can also see where the Yankees might let Giradi interview with the Nationals as well. I don’t know who the next Dodger Manager might be if Mattingly leaves but I can see where Mattingly goes to the Yankees and Giradi goes to the Nats.

  • Bumsrap

    If I were to sum up what went wrong I think it would be that the Dodgers swung at too many balls way out of the strike zone not only in game 5 but for the whole series.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Not sure that sums it up, Mets Ked more than the Dodgers did.

  • Bumsrap

    It would have been nice if Crawford could have started in game 5 but he had been swinging at so many pitches a foot out of the strike zone that he basically forced the Dodgers to bench him. With a tough right handed pitcher going in an elimination game and the Dodgers sitting a $31,000,000 a year left handed batter and inserting a rookie right handed batter in his place that really is a platoon player against left handed pitchers says a lot about this team.

    • Bob_Hendley

      What does it say besides CC hadn’t looked good so far in the series? Frankly, he never looks looks very good in his PAs until he gets a hit.

      • Bumsrap

        It says the Dodgers do not have their payroll wisely distributed and have a few players blocking the acquisition of a replacement.

        • Bob_Hendley

          OK, but you are talking one player here, no?

        • WBBsAs

          Payroll is not an issue here. Crawford’s salary is a sunk cost that does nothing to keep them from acquiring a better player and he’s generally been productive when healthy. In any event, there’s a lot of money coming off the books this year.

          • Bumsrap

            If the Dodgers did not have Crawford or for that matter Ethier, Kemp would not have been traded and Martin would have been offered enough to sign him.

            If the Dodgers had not traded for Crawford and Gonzales they may have been more apt to make a new ownership splash by signing by out bidding for Tanaka and maybe have done the same this year with Scherzer.

            Its not that they can’t afford more payroll its that they would have to DFA several $30M contracts to find space on their active roster.

          • Bob_Hendley

            Gonzalez!? and then I recall that you were a big fan of WGJ (me too) However, not sure that would have worked out. OPS+ of 103 since leaving the Dodgers at a prime hitting position. I’ll take AGon’s 127. Even on the defensive side, Loney has put up -1.8 WAR compared to Adrians’ 0.5.

          • Bumsrap

            I won’t deny loving WGJ but as I read your reply, I have yet to figure out who that is. It’s kinda driving me a little crazy.

            I like Agon. He is a much better player than Loney. It wasn’t Loney’s skill that made him one of my favorites. I had hopes for him. I wound really liking his personality.

            He is still one of the best fastball hitters which is great for late innings relievers who now throw mostly fastballs. He was more than sufficient as a #6 or #7 hitter.

            At the time of the trade with Boston the Dodgers weakest bat was at LF and they needed a cleanup hitter. I have always thought that they should have tried to get a left fielder who could hit cleanup.

          • Bob_Hendley

            Weird Game James, a nickname for Loney given to him by his housemate Delwyn “Pee Wee” Young.

  • foul tip

    No way to know if AJ’s resurgent bat would have made a difference, but obviously putting Grandal in the lineup when he had near zero chance to get even one hit was the wrong move. AJ’s recent performance and playoff history cried out for him to start over the injured Grandal, and IMO AJ has every right to be highly offended that he didn’t, no matter any “whatever helps the team win” stuff he might say.

    DM may not have made that or other lineup decisions. There was a defense-first narrative from the team about Game 5, which fits the front office reputation–though offense in any form is tough to get v deGrom.

    Defense-first didn’t work so well. The failure last night clearly was on the RISP-challenged offense.The Dodgers should have had at least 3-4 more runs. Someone had to come thru when deGrom was on the ropes.

    No one did. End of story.

    So, on to next year, which starts too early.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Donnie makes all the line up decisions. That’s what managers do. In the case of this FO, I would imagine with a lot of input.

      • WBBsAs

        The front office is not Ted Turner, however.

      • foul tip

        According to a couple things I’ve seen lately, input maybe in the form of some strong suggestions. If he didn’t agree, would he go with his employer’s suggestions anyway?

        • Bob_Hendley

          What is it that would make you think something like this, particularly with a guy like Donnie?

          • foul tip

            Intended more as a question than an assumption, based on a couple things from national writers. Don’t have links. When you get down to it they don’t have first-hand knowledge either, just better sources than fans.

            If the FO does insist on certain things, I doubt they do so very often.

          • Bob_Hendley

            My guess is that they sit down before every series and discuss the line up during the regular season and for every game in the playoffs.

          • foul tip

            Probably. This FO is not exactly hands-off, but neither are they micromanagers. As a general principle, good management puts good people in place, then gives them the tools and freedom to do a job. That’s the impression I get of this FO.

            Not to say they’d never insist on something. But no idea what that might be.

          • Bob_Hendley

            The feeling around here seems to be is that the one thing they insist on is for Heisey to play.

          • package206

            What does “a guy like Donnie” mean?

          • Bob_Hendley

            The fellow who called out management for being wishy-washy in its support and insisted on a three year contract before he would return.

          • package206

            So you don’t think that Donnie is not a “Yes” man in any way? He marches to his own drummer?

    • RBI

      Last night was one of the most frustrating Dodger games I have ever attended. First of all, and no one here has mentioned this so I’m curious if my eyes deceived me, Greinke seemed to be getting seriously squeezed, while DeGrom got several of what looked like the exact same balls just outside called as strikes. That hurt us when DeGrom was struggling. Secondly, Greinke’s inexplicable decision to challenge Murphy with that low and in pitch. Really? Then?!?! With a free swinger right behind him? Third, the asleep at the wheel stolen base. Fourth, Grandal, who could barely lift his bat – although he should have walked at least once more, given the bad ump call. (Maybe the ump “didn’t believe in not swinging.”) and Fifth, DM not putting on a squeeze when DeGrom was so shaky.But the offense is the most to blame. We had them on the ropes, and we couldn’t land anything resembling a punch. This was a loss on everyone. I’m just glad it didn’t happen to Kersh this time. And we’re on to the next year! Meanwhile, even though I grew up a Mets fan, for this round, I’m rooting for the Cubs. The wounds aren’t healed yet.
      Oh, and the fans were great last night. Whoever said a pin could drop was wrong. They screamed their support all night, and stayed until the last futile strike!

      • Howard Fox

        but none of that matters…if the Dodgers can get any hits at all in the first few innings….

        • RBI

          Yes, as I concluded.

          • Howard Fox

            sorry, my mistake….so you did

          • RBI

            No worries! I probably should have started with that. Buried the lede…

  • foul tip

    From Grant Brisbee’s very fair take on the Dodgers. Well worth a read…

    “… The Dodgers are as good as the team that will win the 2015 World Series. Put them in direct competition with 162 head-to-head games, and maybe they’ll win 85 or 90 of them. The Dodgers have two of the very best pitchers in the game, with a lineup that generally does good things. They have a fantastic closer and a deep bench, and they were set up well for the postseason. They just ran into Daniel Murphy.”

    http://www.sbnation.com/2015/10/16/9549083/dodgers-mets-postseason-playoffs-nlds?_ga=1.246579331.666919774.1438132480

    • Howard Fox

      and with a couple timely hits, Murphy would have been irrelevent

      • Audit

        A fastball up the side of his head would have made him irrelevant… I don’t really believe in those tactics but there was a time it would have been the accepted way to handle him.

        • Howard Fox

          Utley would have done it, anything to win…

        • WBBsAs

          Intimidation – pitching inside – is OK. A deliberate attempt to injure is not. Part of pitching is fooling the batter.

        • Bumsrap

          Turner would have been a target as well under that thinking.

    • RBI

      I’m glad he wrote this. The post last night, weirdly, really hurt my feelings. I like his writing so much I forget that he hates the Dodgers, and it shocked me to read his glee at our loss…

      • WBBsAs

        I don’t think Grant hates the Dodgers, but he’s not above a little Schadenfreude.

  • Audit
  • Audit

    Buster Olney and Keith Law of ESPN discussed the Dodgers in today’s podcast (audio link, with Law appearing around the 27-minute mark), specifically last night’s game (including managerial decisions on both sides) and the future of Mattingly. Both Olney and Law feel that Mattingly will be dismissed. Law opines that while Mattingly isn’t one of the game’s better tactical managers, he’s not among the worst, and much of the team’s postseason struggles must be blamed on the front office and the roster construction. Olney discusses the fact that Andrew Friedman’s strategy of building platoons and part-time roles worked in Tampa Bay with less-established players, but it’s highly difficult to make that strategy work when dealing with veteran players on expensive contracts. Also discussed is how the Dodgers should be willing to overpay to retain Greinke, with Law projecting Greinke’s style of pitching to hold up well over the life of a theoretical free agent contract. (From MLBTR)

    • Bob_Hendley

      Haven’t read the article, but not sure what “highly difficult to make that strategy work” means in regard to platooning. We are basically talking about LF and RF. Dre had his best season ever as a Dodger measured by OPS+ and CC was injured so much that he only had 193 PA.

  • Another rehash from Bleacher Report.

    What happened in Game 5 was essentially a microcosm of L.A.’s 2015
    season. It seemed like the club couldn’t be stopped early in the
    campaign, hitting its peak at 22-10 in mid-May. But from there,
    adversity got in the way, and the Dodgers roughed it to a good-not-great
    92-70 record.

    • Audit

      I think some of us kept trying to make the point here that that winning percentage was unacceptably low, the club’s personnel SHOULD have been capable of much more.

      • Bob_Hendley

        That may well be, but not sure that it has much to do with the playoffs (and a game being a microcosm). The teams with the top two winning percentages in baseball are nowhere to be found.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Sept/Oct clip of .591 was the same as the April/May clip.

  • Audit

    Some forms of madness are apparently allowed here, how about schizophrenia?

    • Only in its milder forms, please.

      • Audit

        I was thinking of the Multiple Personalities variety, creating another identity here so I would have someone to talk to….

        • “I’ve got it, Earl! We’ll publish our schedules so we know when we’re likely to find another person here!”

          What we need is another 10 or 20 regular commenters to up the odds you’ll find someone here at any time of the day.

          • Audit

            I josh, of course…

  • Here’s a wildly entertaining account of the Blue Jays – Rangers seventh inning in Game Five which ended with Joey Bats’ home run. Written by Joe Posnanski and Michael Schur.

  • Audit

    The FO is quiet today, they’re busy sharpening their axes…

  • WinnipegDave

    Just read this quote about hope that describes this site for me:

    Hope doesn’t say “Everything will be ok.”
    Hope says “We will get through this together.”

    Blah. I didn’t see it, but apparently snow was in the air today in Winnipeg. Winter is truly coming…

    Hanging in here with you all until Spring.

  • NPUT ALCS thread. For Dodger post-mortems, keep talking here.

    • John_from_Aus

      The sky is falling, the sky is falling

  • WinnipegDave

    I know this is probably too soon for some of us but this question popped into my mind:

    Is Kershaw the best Dodger player never to have played in a World Series? Where would he rank for you on an all-time of greats?

    • Audit

      With 30 Major League Clubs, there will be quite a few great players who never play in a World Series.

    • WinnipegDave

      To answer my own question with one quick stat (WAR from Baseball Reference) – Kershaw is the player with the highest career WAR for the Dodgers never to make it to the WS.

      • WinnipegDave

        Of course, I kinda cheated. Dazzy Vance for example had a career war of 61.6 with the Dodgers (highest for any Dodger pitcher) but didn’t get into a WS until 1934 – 2 years after he left Brooklyn.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Hopefully it’s too soon for Clayton.

    • package206

      I love Kersh but I will always be partial to Koufax as he is who I saw as a boy and was incredible. To think of then and know that the baseball was pitched as it was will ever be etched in my mind.

  • Audit

    If this posting stays up till Spring Training, it would likely have several thousand comments, maybe a world record.

    • package206

      Where are you?

  • foul tip

    Saw this and wonder if Bob H or anyone else can verify the Dodger OPS by halves as claimed? Timing is everything, but if accurate it would very much fit a lot of perceptions.

    “Dodgers were 1st in OPS during the 1st half, but 9th in the second half. It was the worst second half offense of any playoff team. It was inadequate to the task of facing a good pitching staff like the Mets.”

    • Bob_Hendley

      Don’t know the source, but no reason to doubt these numbers, but will check. Always best to cut these sorts of numbers in different ways to see how they look, for example by month. Particularly in the case of the Dodgers not having Howie and Justin for extended periods during the second half, but then having them for the playoffs (and them hitting the ball pretty well), i.e, the second half team was not the team we had in the playoffs.

    • Bob_Hendley

      Yeah, these are the numbers (though I measure by OPS+ – don’t think there is all that much difference unless your team is the Rox). BTW, Mets were top team in the second half. For the season, we came in second to Rox (like last year) and Mets 9th.

    • Bob_Hendley

      The second half numbers are interesting to contemplate in terms of looking forward to next year and the offense and where the FO might try to make adjustments to the roster. Grandal getting well, Joc making the adjustment and Seager continuing with the promise shown would be factors. Would be great if Howie agreed to another one year contract to see how Quique and Peraza develop, but seems unlikely. He will want 3-4 years and the FO may not want to give it to him. Another right handed outfield bat, particularly if they continue with platooning approach might be important, though Quique might fit in there as well. Not sure where this leave Schebler. Not sure when and if they bail on CC, as the cost of doing so declines. Barnes could be in the mix as 2nd back up and an extra catcher.

  • foul tip

    David Price went 9-1 with a 2.30 ERA in 11 starts for Toronto. Hadn’t realized he did quite that well.

    Cueto and Hamels, not so good for KC and TX. But Price hasn’t done so well postseason:

    12 games, 6 starts, 50.0 IP, 51 H, 9 HR, 11 BB, 43 K, 2-6 W-L, 1 save, 1.24 WHIP 5.04 ERA. Make than 7.20 ERA so far in this year’s playoffs. 2 HR, 8 IP, 10 H. Ouchie.

    So the “can’t win in postseason” narrative is available. No doubt it will be brought up if he’s a Dodger. And it would absolutely mean nothing for him in future years, same as it did for Kershaw.

    Would have been the height of dumb to give up prize prospects for Price as just a rental with his FA looming. He likely remembers the doggy red carpet rolled out for his mutt a couple years back when Tampa visited DS for the first time. Selling future free agents on your team thru their pets dept., evidently.

    http://m.mlb.com/cutfour/2013/08/09/56441664/david-prices-dog-got-the-vid-treatment-at-dodger-stadium

  • New Dodgers post at the top.